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Author Topic: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP  (Read 32429 times)

Offline alien_concepts

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #15 on: May 29, 2016, 01:14:04 am »
I work on mine tired a lot also. You are correct, we want to build but mistakes creep up. That is one thing I am an expert at. Seeing your other builds, and where this is at so far, you have nothing to fear. You are extremely skilled and this is going to be great. I can't wait to see it finished.
May the Swartz be with you...

Offline Jimmypop57

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2016, 08:05:51 am »
Always fun when you realize you made an oops! Can't wait to see how it comes out!
I play, I putty, I spray, and pray! Putty, sand, repeat...
All putty and no spray makes TOS models green and gray... All putty and no spray makes TOS models green and gray... All putty and no spray makes TOS models green and gray... All putty and no spray makes TOS models green and gray...

Offline trekker9211

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2016, 05:42:58 pm »
I don't think I've EVER had a simple build, although they started out that way. This is a kit I never did pick up, but this is 'fascinating' (sorry, couldn't help it) work your doing.
You'll figure out the 'bugs' and it will look great when your done Steve!
Phil

Offline MSgtUSAFRet

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #18 on: May 31, 2016, 08:21:28 am »
Good Day, Guys!

I hope everyone had a safe and productive weekend!

a_c, Thanks for the excellent words! I've already made some progress and I am getting the bug to see her completed, too!

Jimmypop57, "fun" is not the word I would use... ;D and Thanks!

Phil, welcome back! And with a Star Trek:TOS reference!! This is what I get for thinking it would be a "simple" build!

So, in between yard work and my "honey-do list", I was able to put some time in on the BOP. I reheated the dorsal cut out and tamed it to a suggestion of concave instead of screaming about it. I also placed a tab in the Aft section to allow me to accurately place the cutout and once I had it a better position, I reattached it. I have some "seams" (read glacier crevasses) to fill, but I already have some ideas about that.


20160526_203515

Here I was prepping to attach the Stern of the ship. If you will look at the last picture I posted you can see there is a step from the cutout to the Stern. I didn't want that to be noticeable on the finished model, so I took a bur and placed as shown to make sure the concavity was maintained in the Stern. I also cut some finish lines in both the stern and the main body to 1) increase the surface area to allow the acrylic to bond and 2) to give me something to finish back to.

20160527_112648

Then I used the paint brush method for applying the acrylic and placed acrylic to attach the stern. Once I finished it back with a Dremel and an acrylic finishing bur, you can see the clear and clean finish line between the hull and the stern. Also, I introduced strip styrene (0.040mm x 0.080MM) onto the outer hull diameter in a stair-step pattern all the way around the hull edge (with the exception of where the wings attach to the hull). This was a mod I picked up from Jay Denniss' build on culttvman.com.


20160528_082039

20160530_081650

I marked where the wings would go and left them free from the strip styrene.


20160530_081712

Over this, Jay placed a stripe of 0.020mm sheet styrene plating to create the angled hull perimeter. I noticed that if I just placed the sheet styrene plating over the strips, there would still be a gap I would have to fill later. So, without taking away any of the width of the dorsal-most (is that a word?!) strip, I angled the strips to better align the sheet styrene plating to the hull.


20160531_044036

20160531_044308

Then I glued the plating on the moded strips and, IMHO, it looks better with less discernible gap. Of course I tested it on the Stern as it would be less visible (no pun intended) than it would be on the Bow of the Ship. :)


20160531_045315

I am planning on mixing a batch of acrylic and shoving it into the crevasses, but, if I plan to make a "peak" for the hull contour out of it, I'll have to plan a bit more before I start slapping acrylic on the model!

Till then,

"Better to die for the Emperor than live for yourself!"

Steve
« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 01:47:13 pm by MSgtUSAFRet »
"To be honest with you, Picard, a significant number of my crew members have expressed a desire to return even knowing the odds. Some because they can't bear to live without their loved ones, some because they don't like the idea of slipping out in the middle of a fight."

Offline KevinH

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #19 on: May 31, 2016, 09:04:22 am »
There is no doubt in my mind that you will pull off the impossible!!! If it were me... well, lets say a new kit would be on the way :)

Offline AlW

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2016, 09:17:12 am »
Hey Steve, you're making really good progress on this!  The stair-stepping approach should turn out looking really clean without a lot of puttying/sanding afterwards.

One question in retrospect:  Do you think you could've heated the stern locally with a heat gun and forced (or stretched) the concave surface instead of cutting it out and reinserting it?  What if you made a stress release cut at the top of the section (near the saucer dome) and then pressed in the center while heating it?  Just thinking ahead to what approach I might take when I pull this kit out of my stash;)

Offline MSgtUSAFRet

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2016, 10:50:00 am »
Aw, come’on, Kevin! If you don’t take risks, you won’t learn anything. Besides “Doctor McCoy is right in pointing out the enormous danger potential in any [scale model build as fantastic and complex] as this, but I must point out that the possibilities - the potential for knowledge and advancement - is equally great. Risk! Risk is our business. That's what this starship is all about. That's why we [build] her!” ~ Apologies to Capt. Kirk!

Al,
Whoa, that’s a very good question and suggestion. The answer is a tough one. Since cutting out the dorsal section Aft of the Superstructure and flipping it over doesn’t gain much, I wouldn’t recommend this course of action; unless you used an extremely thin cutting disc and cut at slow speed and are familiar with using a heat-gun to warp the plastic.

Using an ultra-thin cutting disc would give you a finer line when finished and less to putty later. The cutting and heating does have some benefit as the heat is localized to the part only which can then be flexed without warping the other areas of the model.

Placing a stress relief cut, if I can follow your thinking in placing the cut Aft of the Superstructure from Port to Starboard and a similar, parallel cut on the Stern of the model, may work. But I would still have some concerns with this approach. Just trying to think through this, the surrounding areas might act as a heat sink requiring more heat to be applied to the area you are trying to stretch. Heating it on the model may cause warping in the surrounding areas that might be irreparable.

If you did relief cuts as described above but added a single cut running bow to stern, in the same direction as the slot for the dorsal fin, then the area may more readily flex. But, depending on the amount of deformation you want, would make a V-shaped “seam” that would be larger nearer the Stern than the Superstructure.

Granted, this thinking is using an old hairdryer for the heat. If you had access to a heat-gun, with a focused, flat nozzle you might achieve better results.

How would I do it if I could do it again?

A couple of things come to mind:

1. I could make a pattern using baseplate wax or something similar. I would form the ridge that runs from Aft of the Superstructure to the outside (Port for instance) point on the Stern. I could flip the dorsal hull into a plaster/stone matrix, make an impression of the wax and hull, then mix acrylic and monomer, put the mix into the stone matrix, seat the model back into the matrix and let it setup. Finish it down with burs and a Dremel.

2. Attach a strip of styrene on the surface of the hull and then mix acrylic and monomer up and butter-knife the acrylic against the styrene and then, once set, finish it down.

3. I guess you could do the same thing with a sheet of styrene (0.020”). Run a strip from the superstructure to the point of the Stern, then lay a sheet over the strip, one, custom-cut piece toward interior and a second custom-cut piece toward the outside.  This might work better than any other solution.

So what do you think?
« Last Edit: May 31, 2016, 10:52:21 am by MSgtUSAFRet »
"To be honest with you, Picard, a significant number of my crew members have expressed a desire to return even knowing the odds. Some because they can't bear to live without their loved ones, some because they don't like the idea of slipping out in the middle of a fight."

Offline AlW

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2016, 11:09:02 am »
Well, anything having to do with a "stone matrix" sounds like something I'd want to try, but way too complicated;)

You've got some good thinking here and you may be right that heating a large portion of the hull could warp the entire model in ways you can't recover from.  I may try an experiment on some saucers I've got laying around.

I'm intrigued by your third concept below, but not following it, because it has simplicity going for it.  Can you elaborate?

Al

Offline MSgtUSAFRet

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #23 on: May 31, 2016, 11:41:55 am »


“Please excuse the crudity of this model. I didn't have time to build it to scale or paint it.” ;)

I was just thinking if you took some strip styrene laying it on the hull and run it from the superstructure to the point of the Stern, (red line) then lay, one, custom-cut piece of a sheet over the strip toward interior (green triangle) and a second custom-cut piece toward the outside (blue triangle) – in effect creating a Tee-Pee with the strip and sheets – this would create a concave look for the Aft section.

Just thinking… (a dangerous pastime, I know!)

Steve
"To be honest with you, Picard, a significant number of my crew members have expressed a desire to return even knowing the odds. Some because they can't bear to live without their loved ones, some because they don't like the idea of slipping out in the middle of a fight."

Offline Shawn McClure

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #24 on: May 31, 2016, 01:41:40 pm »
Looks great so far Steve.  You are the master of patience.
To build or not to build.... that is the question.   The answer.... build... Duh.

Offline AlW

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #25 on: May 31, 2016, 02:28:32 pm »
Thanks, Steve, I think I see what you're getting at.  I'll try to run a heating experiment in the next few weeks to see if that's an option too.

Offline MSgtUSAFRet

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #26 on: June 06, 2016, 08:18:42 am »
You are the master of patience.

Shawn, more like "Slow builder!" ;D

Al, I looked forward to reading about the results!

In order to get the sheet styrene plating to properly fit the perimeter of the Ship, I created a paper pattern to use to cut the plating. I marked it out on the sheet styrene and cut it out. It seems to have worked - with the exception of a few jagged edges and crooked lines.

20160601_044235

I'm trying to figure out a way to make a cleaner cut on the plating. I'd rather not have to do too much sanding once it is in place. It may be unavoidable. Another issue is the reduction of the Superstructure. I don't think I will be able to reduce it as much as the Diamond Select Toy has done but at least as much as is shown in the pic.

20160601_051957

I also began to look at continuing the "lip" that encompasses the dorsal hull on to the added Stern. The width of the strip styrene I added around the perimeter of the dorsal hull is approximately 0.140" (3.556 mm) so I need to reduce the ventral of the stern down to keep the look. Here I have marked the approx. width but I may wait until after I have reattached the cut-out with acrylic to redefine "lip".

20160601_221520

I printed my plan for the grids on the upper hull and tried to fit it to the model. What I discovered was the superstructure on the model was MUCH bigger than the McMichael plans. So, I guess it's back to the drawing/planning board for me as to where to place the gridlines. The other "landmark" is the placement of the windows/sensors/thingies between the plans and the model. The model places them further away from the superstructure than do the plans. I guess it's not a problem as I can always sand them off and place them where I want them to be - so it's comes down to a matter of preference. I think the plans are too close to the superstructure, but the grids look ok.

Any inputs or opinions?

20160602_203009

I also worked on the lighting breadboard. I borrowed heavily from our own scottminium and his website http://www.scottshobbyplace.com/SciFiModels/IKS-IP/BuildingK-Tinga.html for the starting point of wiring up my BOP. Here is the breadboard design and the schematic I borrowed from http://led.linear1.org/led.wiz. It works for me, but if some of you electronics wizards wouldn't mind giving me feedback on the design, I would appreciate it!

20160605_053038a TOS Romulan BOP Lighting Schematic
20160605_053038

I have more to post later, but I wanted to get some feedback from you excellent modelers on the lighting scheme!

This build is a real stretch for me! I haven't done this type of electronics before and feel so like "a fish out of water" about it. I have wired house lights, ceiling fans and home outlets, but never have I had to calculate resistance and load for lighting. BUT - what a gas to see the thing light up and not go pop! Whoa!

Anyway, thanks for reading and for the input and comments!

Even in Death I still serve!

Steve
« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 02:07:31 pm by MSgtUSAFRet »
"To be honest with you, Picard, a significant number of my crew members have expressed a desire to return even knowing the odds. Some because they can't bear to live without their loved ones, some because they don't like the idea of slipping out in the middle of a fight."

Offline Shawn McClure

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #27 on: June 06, 2016, 11:39:34 am »
Looks great Steve.   Just do a good test of the LED's before you put them in.   Then leave them on for at least 24 hours before you seal things up.   Don't want to have to open the model back up to replace anything later.

Hang in there buddy.  It's going to turn out great.
To build or not to build.... that is the question.   The answer.... build... Duh.

Offline Caladonis

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #28 on: June 06, 2016, 09:01:39 pm »
I calculated these by hand and got some slightly different values. Your first 3 are a bit small -  NOT recommended, 4 - 6 are a bit large (will just be a little dimmer than max brightness)

1. 240 Ohms
2. 240 ohms
3. calcs to 250, nearest higher standard value is 270 ohms
4. calcs to 350, nearest higher standard value is 360 ohms
5. 150 Ohms
6. None, will not fully light - may be bright enough and pull about 18 ma, with a 100 ohm resistor will pull 15 ma.

Note that they all should light, and even the first 3 are only marginally over driving the led, but I would increase the values of the first three circuits.

 

Offline MSgtUSAFRet

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Re: AMT 1/650 TOS Romulan BOP
« Reply #29 on: June 07, 2016, 07:50:38 am »
Shawn, Thanks! Why should I...

 
...leave them on for at least 24 hours before you seal things up.   Don't want to have to open the model back up to replace anything later.

Is this a type of "burn in" process for the wiring and LEDs? Jus askin... :)

Don, Thanks for hand cranking and checking my numbers! What formula and variables did you use so I can be sure I am doing it right next time? Thanks abunch!

I realized I needed to duplicate the angle/bevel of the forward Hull on the Stern. Since I added 0.140” to the perimeter of the hull and since I needed to maintain the "lip" around to the Stern, I marked 0.140" to guide me in reducing horizontally the added, scratch-built Stern. But as I said last post; "I may wait until after I have reattached the cut-out with acrylic to redefine "lip"." I still need to create the angle match the rest of the ship and decided I needed to vertically reduce the ventral portion of the Stern 0.140".

20160605_062735

Then, using the same paper pattern I’d made for the forward hull perimeter, I cut and fit a piece for the stern. Although the camera angle isn’t the best to see it, but on the left side of the picture you can see a large seam/gap. I’ll fill that later as I’m allowing the natural curve of the styrene plating to create a smoother curve for me. Also, since I am not yet done with the Aft section of the ship (re-attaching the cut-out, light-block painting, etc., I’m gonna leave the stern unattached so I can light-block in there and cut rough-outs for the Impulse LEDs; so I labeled it and set it aside.

20160605_064259

I also recut the styrene plating for the forward hull perimeter. As I was a little more trusting of the ventral portion of the plating, I set the model on the desk, placed the plating on the level (so to speak) desk surface, and attached the plating. Despite numerous refinements, I still ended up with a lip on the added strip styrene. Not sure if I wanna cut that off with a sharp exacto knife or if I wanna carefully use a bur and a dremel.
Still thinking…

20160605_193752

When I can get another hour or so on the model, I think I'll re-attach the cut out section. Then move on to marking and drilling out the windows/sensor/thingies in the hull. Oh, and reduce the superstructure.

Thanks abunch for reading, commenting and following along!

Till then...

Keep reaching for the stars! (Casey Kasem – the "original" Shaggy!)

Steve
« Last Edit: February 27, 2018, 02:56:08 pm by MSgtUSAFRet »
"To be honest with you, Picard, a significant number of my crew members have expressed a desire to return even knowing the odds. Some because they can't bear to live without their loved ones, some because they don't like the idea of slipping out in the middle of a fight."

 




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